can we use a 0 to 24 VDC power supply to control the clutch brake system ?

[dineshdeshmuk]

can we use a 0 to 24 VDC power supply to control the clutch brake system (magnetic) ?

i want to replace the tension controllers with power supply cards of 0 to 24 VDC (can vary with a pot.) ..... cause i want 0 to 24 VDC supply at the brake of a magnetic clutch brake system .......

THANx

 

[ark5230]

Where is the problem !

 

[dineshdeshmuk]

Where is the problem !

what do you mean by that " Where is the problem ! " ?

Can we use it or not ?

reply at the earliest

 

[kak111]

Theoretically yes.
Braking force is controlled with brake coil current and usually system has some tension feedback
for controlling braking force value when web speed varies.
Since the aim is to keep the web tension constant regardless of speed changes.

Tension control brakes and clutches are not structurally normal motor brakes.
These devices have been made to carry out the continuous braking to maintain the controlled web tension.
this mean that usually some cooling is added to brake unit.
Torque is strictly proportional to Excitation Current applied to Coil.
These devices come with matching electronics to meet your most exacting applications such as
Torque Control, Tension Control, Stretch Control,..

examples......

http://www.powerdrive.co.uk/pdfs/04-Tension-control-brakes.pdf

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[Raza]

Yes, it can be used but you must have proper electronics to control the proper current supply at demanded and set pressure (as said in post #4)

 

[dineshdeshmuk]

typically for 5kg & for 10 kg brake what should be the supply current of the power supply ?

thanks

---------- Post added at 20:58 ---------- Previous post was at 20:52 ----------

would you provide me the circuit or schematic to build that variable power supply from 0 to 24 VDC ?

thanks

 

[kak111]

typically for 5kg & for 10 kg brake what should be the supply current of the power supply ?

kg is unit for mass

to control the brake unit , we must know braking torque
to calculating torgue we must know the needed force on web and actual roll diameter
there are many additional dynamic parameters and variables in brake unit and in machine mechanics
so that all these variables can be taken into account must we know the actual web speed
and then you can create all the mathematical control functions for calculating needed electric current
to brake unit in all various driving situations of the production .

Simple ???? No. No.

would you provide me the circuit or schematic to build that variable power supply from 0 to 24 VDC ?

Here is some principles , if you will try .........
( Do not count me in to this )



Winder Tension Control an Adaptive Control System Tutorial
Winder Tension Control System For Tension Regulation of Web Winders

Closed Loop PID Control
A brief overview of tension transducer measurement and PID control
http://www.dfe.com/pdfs/tension101.pdf

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[dineshdeshmuk]

How can i calculate the braking torque ?

the roll diameter varies from different sizes to different ....... so , there is not any constant diameter .....

web speed also varies and it can be varied down or up by means of pot ..........

How to evaluate the needed force on web ?

thanks a lot for your excellent effort

 

[ark5230]

If these parameters are changing from place to place, use the values applicable at the point of interest. Formula for torque is simple and also given in the figure attached to post #7 by KAK. Similar things apply to speed as well.

 

[Gimlix]

Don't you have any manufacturer data or information related with the device you are going to control? I would invest some time trying to know exactly "the name" of the clutch and the send some email or just a phone call to the manufacturer.

 

[kak111]

Here is a manual for a tension controller, so you can read about
connections and sensors, how to setup and tune....etc,etc.
and you find out that it is not so simple device.

TECHNICAL REFERENCE MANUAL
DIGITAL TENSION CONTROLLER
STEADYWEB™5

SECTION ONE PRODUCT DESCRIPTION
SECTION TWO INSTALLATION...........8
SECTION THREE USER INTERFACE OVERVIEW............23
SECTION FOUR CALIBRATION............30
SECTION FIVE SETUP............37
SECTION SIX TUNING ADJUSTMENTS............46
SECTION SEVEN OPERATING INSTRUCTIONS...........50
SECTION EIGHT CARE AND MAINTENANCE...........54
SECTION EIGHT CARE AND MAINTENANCE..........55
SECTION TEN REPLACEMENT PARTS..........59

in page 2
Figure 2 - EXAMPLES OF TENSION ZONES

in page 18
Figure 12 - STANDARD AND 0-10VDC CONTROL BOARD ELECTRICAL CONNECTIONS

in page 19
Figure 13 - CONTROL BOARD TRANSDUCER ELECTRICAL CONNECTIONS AND REMOTE OPTION

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[dineshdeshmuk]

the maximum roll radius is 13.5 inches ........ the maximum speed of shaft (motor) is 160 rev/min ?

now how to evaluate the braking force needed on web ?

thanks

 

[kak111]

how to evaluate the braking force needed on web ?

Torque, moment or moment of force , is the tendency of a force to rotate or brake rotation of the mass on an axis


Look added picture in post #7

You must know the force in web that can keep needed tension.

Needed braking torque in constant speed situation is roll radius times needed force for web tension

when roll is accelerating brake torque must be lower and vice versa higher brake torque for declerating roll.

Used (or needed) brake power is brake torque times rpm ( this value generates heat in brake unit )

 

[dineshdeshmuk]

max volts : DC 24 (0 to 24 variable) , max. amps : 3 amps , max. torque : 200 Nm

 

[dineshdeshmuk]

max volts : DC 24 (0 to 24 variable) , max. amps : 3 amps , max. torque : 200 Nm

 

[kak111]

max volts : DC 24 (0 to 24 variable) , max. amps : 3 amps , max. torque : 200 Nm

I guess these are the max. values for the tension brake.

When designing web-tension control system , you need lot of calculations,
measurements for creating controller mathematical model and functions for brake current drive.

Here is examples for calculations.....
Tension Brakes and Clutches
Design Considerations and Selection
http://www.warnernet.com/PDF/P-771-WE_pg014-036.pdf

Here is more design notes......
Tension and torque control - Designers Notebook
MAGPOWR Designer's Notebook - (12)

as i wrote before Do not count me into this

 

[dineshdeshmuk]

what is pinch roll ?
what is nip roll ?

 

[kak111]

Pinch Roll : A component on a cradle uncoiler that assists uncoiling by pulling on the stock.

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Nip Roll : one of a pair or set of rolls for squeezing materials (as in a wringer)

Nip rolls or pinch rolls are powered rolls that are used to press
two or more sheets together to form a laminated product.

Nip roller units can also be used as pullers for material being pulled off of rolls or being fed between operations.
Nip rolls are sometimes called laminating rolls, laminators, squeeze rolls, pinch rolls or even wringers.

 

[danishdeshmuk]

what is a sleeve ?
what are rubber rollers ?

thanks

 

[dineshdeshmuk]

Kak would you please design any circuit for me in this regard ???? I badly need this