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Can some one teach me "De-emdedding" Tech?!

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Junior Member level 2
Feb 22, 2002
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sonnet pattern ground shield

as title...

I am looking for some document for the De-embedding...
and I am wondering the different between Deembedding and Calibration...

if you have some further information please sent to my email address...


De-embedding and calibration are the basically same, within the context of RF circuit and microwave network. Maybe the word "de-embedding" is used by people doing simulation, while "calibration" is more commonly used when talking about actual measurement. In some case, "de-embedding" is sometimes used to refer to the simple task of moving the reference plane.

What do you want to do with de-embedding? Measurement or numerical simulation? For measurement, what is your setup?

For research, there are a number of paper in IEEE MTT and IM. International journal on microwave and millimeterwave engineering also has one or two. Search for the key words "TRL", "circle fitting", "numerical de-embedding", etc.

Simply put, de-embedding is to remove the effect of high order modes, which is difficult to do exactly. They try to "engineer" the problem by assuming a LINEAR network model and designing different schemes to obtain the model parameters. Some schemes are obvious, others (like TRL) are more clever and involve subtle assumptions.

For the purpose of doing measurement, it would be enough to know what are the assumptions of the method and make the requirements are satisfied in your setup and operation.

For theoretical work, you might want to put some time on the issue of "characteristic impedance".


Thanx Loucy...

Now I have some ideas with De-embedding....:)

The reason why I am asking is cuz I am doing spiral inductor design and simulation, however, I am not so sure if the results are correct or not. I am using S*nnet and A*D*S M*menten for EM simulation, and the substrate is setting as 0.25 um Silicon process.

I have checked some papers, adding a pattern ground shield under the spiral inductor will increase the Q factor. But, I am wondering that how to simulated a Pattern "Ground" shield....

I have drawn a "Floatting" pattern shield, and the result didn't improved alot. Thus, if I need to connect the floating pattern shield, shall I setup any thing (or draw any thing) on my simulation layout?!

Thanx for your helps alot...:)

Best regard,

I donot know what the "pattern ground" mean exactly. If you just etch out some conductor from an otherwise perfecting conducting "infinite" plane, you would need solvers which model magnetic currents. As far as I know, Sonnet can't do the job. My impression is Momentum can't either, but I have to check it out. IE3D would be the best shot among commercial tools.

If the 'pattern ground' means something quasi-periodical, which is claimed to be helpful for suppressing the surface waves or leaky waves, you might need customized tools. I am curious whether you are actually persuing this for a company.

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