Welcome to EDAboard.com

Welcome to our site! EDAboard.com is an international Electronics Discussion Forum focused on EDA software, circuits, schematics, books, theory, papers, asic, pld, 8051, DSP, Network, RF, Analog Design, PCB, Service Manuals... and a whole lot more! To participate you need to register. Registration is free. Click here to register now.

PCB design software for High speed design

Status
Not open for further replies.

suryakant

Member level 5
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Messages
90
Helped
6
Reputation
12
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,286
Location
India
Activity points
2,171
Hi all,

which PCB design software i should prefer of the following:
Protel, orcad, allegro or PADS.

EMI/EMC, high speed design and new component libraries availibilty are my issues of concern

Thanx.
 

mkbs

Member level 3
Joined
Apr 10, 2003
Messages
67
Helped
4
Reputation
8
Reaction score
2
Trophy points
1,288
Activity points
626
I think that PADS is the best choise !!
You can draw all kind of PCB you want (from monoface to multilayer) and Blaze route, now, is quite similar to Mentor Expedition route (very easy and powerful), but
I heared that the price for full suite is VERY hi.
... have you never seen Zuken Cadstar ?

MKBS :)
 

suryakant

Member level 5
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Messages
90
Helped
6
Reputation
12
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,286
Location
India
Activity points
2,171
hi MKBS,
Does zuken cadstar supports online new component libraries?
what is major difference between OrCAD and Allegro....though both are from Cadence.
 

hock

Advanced Member level 2
Joined
May 28, 2001
Messages
525
Helped
47
Reputation
94
Reaction score
21
Trophy points
1,298
Location
India
Activity points
3,567
even wirh layout plus you can not do high speed designs.
you will need spectra and spectra quest SI for routing and si analysis.

both pads and spectra are very costly tools.
protel is shit shit and shit............
it is a west of your money. you can not use it for high speed design.
learning curve is too steep. interface is poor.
hock
 

mkbs

Member level 3
Joined
Apr 10, 2003
Messages
67
Helped
4
Reputation
8
Reaction score
2
Trophy points
1,288
Activity points
626
I don't know what you means with "supports online new component libraries"
but you can find a particular component on Zuken web page and download it.
Moreover, you can create your library in many kind of database or spreadsheet format (e.g. Excel) ,however like PADS (I don't know about Protel or Allegro).
To complete the last answer, about SI, CadStar offers some difference product...

Top : Route 2000HS with Cadstar SI (Hi cost!...but complete suite)
Medium: Route 2000S with Cadstar EMI (Daisy Chain, trace length...)
Low : Route 2000 (no handle HS) with EMI (a good value for money!!)

mkbs
 

Uky

Member level 5
Joined
Sep 3, 2004
Messages
83
Helped
18
Reputation
36
Reaction score
4
Trophy points
1,288
Location
Swedish West Coast
Activity points
1,205
Dont judge the system after available libraries. Theese are often goofed up and useless. There is also a belief that that full libraries are necessary in order to start design work. Wrong. Create the parts as you go along and choose a system that will fit your needs (and your budget). As soon as high speed signal integrity is a concern, then prices are high.
 

Mazz

Advanced Member level 2
Joined
Nov 3, 2001
Messages
676
Helped
131
Reputation
262
Reaction score
50
Trophy points
1,308
Activity points
5,463
suryakant said:
hi MKBS,
what is major difference between OrCAD and Allegro....though both are from Cadence.

Orcad is the very basic one. For school is OK. A lot of companies uses it but, if you need to make mass production is not ok. Very easy.

Allegro is the professional solution. A team can use it. It's not so easy, but powerful.
I prefer PADS and Expedition PCB.

I hope it can help.
Mazz
 

ezpcb

Banned
Joined
Mar 2, 2005
Messages
210
Helped
8
Reputation
16
Reaction score
3
Trophy points
1,298
Activity points
0
To the opnion of the leader of our design team, allegro is the most professional and powerful PCB design software, but is difficult to use.

I like Protel, it's easy to handle and is enough for most designs of mine

mike

-----------------------------------------------
www.ezpcb.com
 

concat

Member level 3
Joined
Dec 5, 2001
Messages
54
Helped
5
Reputation
10
Reaction score
2
Trophy points
1,288
Activity points
753
Hi All,

Follow my experience and my opinion: Cadence PSD is The best for High-End PCB Design. I have some designs for Laptop Mother Board P4 with 24 Layers and a lot of constrains ( area Rules, Daisy Chains, Match Length, Macth impedances,.... A lot lot lot rules). The Electrical Contrains rule of Allegro is the Best. If have no it, I think we can't manage the design.

The Second is Pads Power PCB 2005. Now it is power full ( More easier than Expedition PCB, the Features are near the Same with Expedition 2004), but it still not good about setup constrain for a very Complex Design as Cadence PSD. It is easy to use and have already a lot of FootPrints have updated continuously by PCBExpress and others. U can use OrCad Capture to draw and synthesize with Pads by PCBNavigator 5.

These are 2 software I always use in Design. I know a little about Zuken Cadstar, but It also realy power full soft for Complex PCB Design ( The 3D and Signals Advisor really a usefull)

I agree that Protel is shit shit!!!!!!

Regards
 

Tahar

Member level 3
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
58
Helped
0
Reputation
0
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,286
Activity points
1,832
Hello guys,


Can I know why u hate so much Protel DXP ?

(sorry if the answer of this question is obvious)


Regards,

Tahar
 

skywalker

Advanced Member level 4
Joined
Nov 27, 2001
Messages
119
Helped
5
Reputation
10
Reaction score
1
Trophy points
1,298
Location
Earth
Activity points
1,072
Hi all,

for high speed board design, it's important a front-end schematic with simulation support, and high speed rules manage capability (critical lengh, rise time, stub lengh, impedance, diferrential pairs and others) to pass in PCB.

For PCB Layout, if are not easy or simple to use, it's not important element, but need powerfull for manage large board and manage any h-speed rule. Another important element it's a High-Speed simulator, for Pre-Route and Post-Route analysis.

For this reasons i know only few system with support well High Speed rules: Expedition, Allegro, PADS. Expedition and especially Allegro are expensive but very Powerfull !

PADS are not expensive and need Hyperlynx for simulation, i think it's a very good start choice.
Cadstar are expensive like PADS, but hard to manage h-speed board, it's only my opinion off course.

I agree with Concat for many arguments, Skywalker.
 

jdhar

Full Member level 5
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Messages
258
Helped
16
Reputation
32
Reaction score
2
Trophy points
1,298
Activity points
2,753
I do'nt see what's hard about using rules with Protel... you can manage many net classes, and control all the parameters mentioned. Of course, I haven't done real high-speed design, so I'm merely asking why is it that everyone hates it?
 

Budda

Newbie level 5
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
10
Helped
0
Reputation
0
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,281
Activity points
98
jdhar said:
I do'nt see what's hard about using rules with P*otel... you can manage many net classes, and control all the parameters mentioned. Of course, I haven't done real high-speed design, so I'm merely asking why is it that everyone hates it?

but what would you consider high speed??
 

prd

Member level 3
Joined
May 13, 2003
Messages
57
Helped
6
Reputation
12
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,286
Activity points
499
The thing to do in High Speed Design before you get actual pcb, you required Pre-layout and Post-layout simultion. Or you may be stuck in debug hardware loop, in repairing one net result in disturb other net.

If you are new in design I think Hyperlynx is the easy way to start, You can try hyperlynx demo version from www.mentor.com

I may familiar with pads software. But I ever try start with allegro si it very complex to setup than hyperlynx
 

amjad

Full Member level 5
Joined
Dec 29, 2002
Messages
274
Helped
9
Reputation
18
Reaction score
5
Trophy points
1,298
Activity points
2,291
Cadence allegro is the best choice for HSD , as its has a very effective constraint manager & also it has Specctra Quest for simulation
 

nami

Junior Member level 1
Joined
Feb 6, 2005
Messages
18
Helped
1
Reputation
2
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,281
Activity points
172
salam,,,
noone has mentioned ARES of labcenter proteus, is it not so popular or what ?

i've used protel and this ares in some simple designs(u may call)
 

snake

Member level 4
Joined
Jan 22, 2003
Messages
79
Helped
3
Reputation
6
Reaction score
0
Trophy points
1,286
Activity points
639
and how about pcad ??? from accel eda ?????
 

pvskt

Member level 2
Joined
Jun 25, 2005
Messages
44
Helped
9
Reputation
18
Reaction score
3
Trophy points
1,288
Activity points
1,854
For high speed designs PADS is a very economical and efficient tool.
Expedition PCB, though costly is a real cool tool to use...but cost would be the major constraint in buying the tool. Allegro Expert series will help layouting high speed designs. You will have to use Expert will Specctraquest for achieving a good high speed design.

Well..every tool has its own capabilities and usage. Cadstar is also another powerful and easy to use tool. the recent release incorporates many high speed constraint driven definitions and also SI.

Overall in my experience, economy and efficiency and percentage of dfeature utilizzation factors should be considered before zeroing in on any tool.
 

zxfeng

Member level 2
Joined
Dec 27, 2001
Messages
51
Helped
7
Reputation
14
Reaction score
3
Trophy points
1,288
Activity points
268
I prefer allegro 620 series
 

Status
Not open for further replies.

Part and Inventory Search

Welcome to EDABoard.com

Sponsor

Top