[SOLVED] How can I improve IMD3 ?

[Brkyapali]

Hello all,
I have been designing Power amplifier and I got a serious problem with the IMD3 point. I have got all the power and efficiency I wanted but IMD3 is very high and I don't know what to do. I got not much experience designing PA, I am just a student. How can I reduce IMD3 ? IMD3 value is almost same on the schematic results. In the fifth photo it says 41.7 dBm for fundamental but normally I get 45.6 dbm I wonder if I am doing something wrong pls let me know. Thanks for your help.

 

[dick_freebird]

Something is squaring up the signal, back off power density
/ bigger devices (at cost of more C throughout)?

 

[Brkyapali]

Something is squaring up the signal, back off power density
/ bigger devices (at cost of more C throughout)?

If i lower the power, would not I lost the power and drain efficiency ? and I can not reach the required levels.

 

[BigBoss]

This is a 25W-Class Device and you overdrive the transistor so transistor gets into hard saturation/hard nonlinear mode and exhibits strong nonlinearity.
Also there are some design and layout errors. You cannot design such Power Amplifier without Load Pull simulation/measured data.
Re-visit your design steps by taking Load Pull concept into consideration.

 

[mtwieg]

I have been designing Power amplifier and I got a serious problem with the IMD3 point. I have got all the power and efficiency I wanted but IMD3 is very high and I don't know what to do.

What do you think your IMD3 is? What do you expect it to be?

IMD3 value is almost same on the schematic results.

What do you mean by schematic results?

In the fifth photo it says 41.7 dBm for fundamental

That is just a measure of output power for one of the carriers, not IMD3...

but normally I get 45.6 dbm

"normally" meaning what?

It's unclear whether you are measuring IMD3 correctly in the first place.

 

[volker@muehlhaus]

In the fifth photo it says 41.7 dBm for fundamental but normally I get 45.6 dbm

That is with two tone excitation, correct?

The level for two tone measurement is usually 6dB down from the single tone measurement, i.e. 45.6dBm - 6 dB = 39.6 dBm
I think you drive the amplifier too much into saturation with two tones of 41.7dBm

 

[BigBoss]

Check first P1dB Compression Point to achieve the capability of your Amplifier. In order to do this, sweep Pin from very low levels to appropriate level.
If your P1dB Compression Point is not around almost 10 dB lower than expected OIP3 value, there is absolutely an design error.

RF and Microwave Design are done step-by-step.

If your target is to achieve a good OIP3 ONLY, you have to find the "sweet point" of this transistor by derivating Id-Gm curve.
Gm value will exhibit a sweet-point that reflects minimum 3rd order harmonic.
So third order derivation of this Id vs. Gm curve will give you an insight.

 

[vfone]

Usually I measure IP3 setting the two tone level even lower then 6dB from the level of the single tone test.
In this way I am sure I don't saturate the PA.