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Fractal generation and IE3D(microstrip)

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Junior Member level 2
Nov 1, 2008
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ie3d microstrip

Hello all

Just joined in.Nice to see such a huge collection of Microwave experts here.
I will keep my query short and ask for help of all here in this regard.

Consider a first iteration fractal design of a simple geometry to be used as a micro strip antenna..lets say koch,sierpinski, I want to iterate the design further and continue for 2 iterations and so on.Is there a way in which I could design such complex higher iterations on a software(..I read of a software called Ultra fractal in the forum) and then export it as .dxf and then into ie3d directly thus avoiding the painstaking process of designing the fractal geometry again for further iterations.

Also a MoM based software such as ie3d takes a lot of time to optimize the radiation,BW,gain and other characteristics and requires one to change the geometry each time and rerun the simulation for results...Pls name a software in the market for fractal antenna design that could save our time and effort in optimizing the fractal iterations for these characteristics..

Whats in my mind is this ..a software in which ..

1)One could mention the maximum return loss allowable,gain needed and then input
ONLY the basic first iteration fractal geometry

2)The software must now be able to generate results(res freq,BW,gain) for all higher iterations like a drop down menu.

3)Buttons such as optimize geometry for best bandwidth or say minimum return loss instead of a human dabbling over the geometry for a long time.

If such a thing is not possible is there a method by which a fractal design geometry done on 3rd party software(like Ultrafractal) can be imported into ie3d ?
or would CST microwave suite be better in such matters?or is there any other better solution?please help

And thanks in advance.


Hi, FractalGuy:

I think the IE3DLIBRARY in IE3D may be useful to you.

1. You may be able to parameterize your fractal inside IE3DLIBRARY and you can tune it.
2. In case the structure is too difficult to parameterize, you may be able ot use the UserDefinedObject in IE3DLIBRARY such that you can write your own program to create it based upon the parameters.
3. IE3D does have the capability to optimize return loss and pattern simultaneously.


operation of zeland ie3d

Hi Jian,
also I need optimization in IE3D but I want to do this paratemetric, Do you have any document or useful things?


ie3d fractal

Thanks a lot Jian.
" IE3D does have the capability to optimize return loss and pattern simultaneously"

The above statement of yours has rung a big bell in all of us microwave enthusiasts here.
Could you please substantiate this further with the help of a tutorial,pdf or any other such source-either yours or available online?

ie3d mgrid tutorial

Please find it from



unfortunately I cannot find this here, please put link.

Thanks for the lead Jian.It was very helpful and Leilon it is not a hyperlink just in case you misinterpreted it,browse to your installed zeland ie3d folder and follow the link of must be able to find it.I post here an excerpt fomr it.
Courtesy-Zeland Inc

"MGRID and IE3DLIBRARY are complementary. You can achieve
some goals much easier on MGRID and you can achieve some other
goals much easier on IE3DLIBRARY. MGRID and IE3DLIBRARY
can work together for the maximum flexibility. MGRID contains
matured technology supporting the advanced features on
IE3DLIBRARY. IE3DLIBRARY allows high level geometry
modeling and much improvement will be done in the near future."

Jian it would be a great help if you could share your views on ie3dlibrary and its pros and cons when it comes to fractal analysis.I did see a comparison in the manual; interested in knowing your experience in using it on fractal geometries..


The relationship between MGRID and IE3DLIBRARY is similar to Assembly and C++.

MGRID's basic objects are vertices and polygons. You can edit them easily. You cna modify your shapes by controlling down to the vertices. IE3DLIBRAY's basic obejcts are the basic geometry shapes such as circles, rectangles, ellipses, you can easily change the dimensions while you may not be able to change its small details such as a cut on a circle. As a matter of fact, the Boolean operation in IE3DLibrary does allow you to create a cut on a cirlce easily by combining multiple objects together. The UWB antenna documented in the manual is an excellent example. There is no object as an eliptical shape inside an eliptical shape in the library. However, you can make it from two elliptical shape by digging a hole on another one. Not only that, you can even change the dimensions of the shapes in a coordinated way to achieve the tuning and optimzation. Combing with the FastEM technology implemented into IE3DLIBRARY (and MGRID), users can perform real-time EM tuning and optimization and even synthesis.

For fractal antennas, you can do a lot of things using IE3DLIBRARY. A typical fractal antenna is a one with smallest triangles inside smaller triangles and inside large triangles, .... Using MGRID to build it, you may have to build differnt triangles on different layers. Then, use some triangles to build the holes on another level after alignment. It is ok. However, you can't change the dimensions after you build the polygons. If you parameterize it on IE3DLIBRARY, you can easily change the dimensions. Not only that, you can fine tune your procedure to make sure there is no mistake is make. You can repeat the procedure again and again to test it until it is good. You don't need to worry about making a mistake in some previous step because you always can go back to fix it in IE3DLIBRARY because it is script like internally. You just need to plan ahead more than on MGRID. From our experiences, MGRID is still very useful and it can't be replaced by IE3DLIBRARY even IE3DLIBRARY is more like C++ and MGRID is more like Assembly. There are somethings you still need to use MGRID to achieve it.


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Hey Jian thanks a lot mate.You just helped me :) Thanks again.

Hey others..other methods please...

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