+ Post New Thread
Results 1 to 11 of 11
  1. #1
    Advanced Member level 1
    Points: 4,258, Level: 15

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    400
    Helped
    7 / 7
    Points
    4,258
    Level
    15

    cadence to ADS EM simulation

    I have an inductor from cadence simulation. Can I export the S parameter from cadence and do the EM simulation in ADS? Thanks.

    •   AltAdvertisement

        
       

  2. #2
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 29,995, Level: 42
    BigBoss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Turkey
    Posts
    4,381
    Helped
    1321 / 1321
    Points
    29,995
    Level
    42

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    If you have s-parameters of that inductor, why you wanna simulate it in ADS Momentum ?? Or you just want to use those s-parameters in ADSs Co-Simulation ??
    Your question is a bit floating..


    1 members found this post helpful.

  3. #3
    Advanced Member level 1
    Points: 4,258, Level: 15

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    400
    Helped
    7 / 7
    Points
    4,258
    Level
    15

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Thank you for your reply.

    In Cadence, I want to simulate the two inductors placing very close. I don't know whether Cadence can simulate the coupling effect of the two inductors.


    If Candence can't simulate the coupling effect, then the extracted S parameter is not correct, and converting it into ADS, ADS will not give the coupling effect, right?


    Thank you.



  4. #4
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 16,333, Level: 30
    pancho_hideboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Real Homeless
    Posts
    2,497
    Helped
    665 / 665
    Points
    16,333
    Level
    30

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    What do you mean by “Cadence” ?

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    I don't know whether Cadence can simulate the coupling effect of the two inductors.
    Yes.
    Cadence have design service and device modeling services.
    So Cadence can do any simulation by using almost any vendor tool.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #5
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 13,722, Level: 28

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    2,142
    Helped
    859 / 859
    Points
    13,722
    Level
    28

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    If Candence can't simulate the coupling effect, then the extracted S parameter is not correct, and converting it into ADS, ADS will not give the coupling effect, right?
    EM simulation in ADS (Momentum) is based on the layout, not based on other simulation results (S-parameters).


    1 members found this post helpful.

    •   AltAdvertisement

        
       

  6. #6
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 29,995, Level: 42
    BigBoss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Turkey
    Posts
    4,381
    Helped
    1321 / 1321
    Points
    29,995
    Level
    42

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    Thank you for your reply.
    In Cadence, I want to simulate the two inductors placing very close. I don't know whether Cadence can simulate the coupling effect of the two inductors.
    If Candence can't simulate the coupling effect, then the extracted S parameter is not correct, and converting it into ADS, ADS will not give the coupling effect, right?
    Thank you.
    Cadence ADE does not have any EM simulator that you need to check the coupling effects of two coils.But you can install Sonnet, ADS Momentum even HFSS to verify your coils.
    In order to do this, you should simplify your circuit and leave two coils alone.Place you EM Ports properly then simulate this layout in EM simulator ,you'll get all information about the coils if they are placed very close.They will act as transformer and you can consider these two coupled coils being as transformer then you may place this n-port element which is defined by s-parameter in your electronic circuit schematic.It will need a bit try-and-cut effort but finally you will get an "insight" how the coils effect your circuit.

    Cadence ADE has effectively a RLCk extraction tools such Assura and Calibre from Mentor Graphics but they are not really effective and accurate as much as an EM simulator.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #7
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 16,333, Level: 30
    pancho_hideboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Real Homeless
    Posts
    2,497
    Helped
    665 / 665
    Points
    16,333
    Level
    30

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    https://designers-guide.org/forum/Ya...num=1244552575

    Previously Cadence have VPCD(Virtuoso Passive Component Designer), where we can evaluale coupling of inductors roughly.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 13,722, Level: 28

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    2,142
    Helped
    859 / 859
    Points
    13,722
    Level
    28

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Quote Originally Posted by pancho_hideboo View Post
    Previously Cadence have VPCD(Virtuoso Passive Component Designer), where we can evaluale coupling of inductors roughly.
    Do you work in EDA museum? We discussed VPCD end-of-life ten years ago.


    1 members found this post helpful.

    •   AltAdvertisement

        
       

  9. #9
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 16,333, Level: 30
    pancho_hideboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Real Homeless
    Posts
    2,497
    Helped
    665 / 665
    Points
    16,333
    Level
    30

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    In Cadence, I want to simulate the two inductors placing very close.
    I don't know whether Cadence can simulate the coupling effect of the two inductors.
    I assume you have inductors as PDK.
    So you can get s-parameter of inductor by Sparameter Analysis.
    Here you want to evaluate coulpling between inductors which provided as PDK.

    Answer is no.
    You can not evaluate it by current Cadence Tool Lineup.

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    If Candence can't simulate the coupling effect,
    then the extracted S parameter is not correct,
    How do you extract S parameter by Cadence Tool ?

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    and converting it into ADS,
    ADS will not give the coupling effect, right?
    No.

    You can not get S-parameter by any Cadence Tool.
    So your thinking above is completely nonsense.

    You have to use EM analysis tool.
    If you prefer Keysight Momentum on ADS design framework, import layout data to ADS from Virtuoso.
    If you have Momentum integration for Virtuoso, you can do Momentum Analysis directly in Virtuoso environment.

    Quote Originally Posted by volker@muehlhaus View Post
    We discussed VPCD end-of-life ten years ago.
    I know.
    Surely see https://designers-guide.org/forum/Ya...num=1244552575

    However still we can use it in Cadence MMSIM-6.X unofficially.



  10. #10
    Advanced Member level 1
    Points: 4,258, Level: 15

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    400
    Helped
    7 / 7
    Points
    4,258
    Level
    15

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Thank you for all you reply. Yes, then I switched to the ADS EM simulation. It works for the coupling effect simulation.

    It is weird that Cadence dose not provide good RF simulation enviroment.



  11. #11
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 16,333, Level: 30
    pancho_hideboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Real Homeless
    Posts
    2,497
    Helped
    665 / 665
    Points
    16,333
    Level
    30

    Re: cadence to ADS EM simulation

    Quote Originally Posted by shanmei View Post
    It is weird that Cadence dose not provide good RF simulation enviroment.
    See https://community.keysight.com/servl...e+Virtuoso.pdf


    1 members found this post helpful.

--[[ ]]--