+ Post New Thread
Results 1 to 11 of 11
  1. #1
    Newbie level 4
    Points: 33, Level: 1

    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    6
    Helped
    0 / 0
    Points
    33
    Level
    1

    Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Hello all!
    I'm modelling a phase shifter in AWR Microwave Office. I need a spice-model of pin- or Shottky-diode that has quality factor switching > 1000. Operation frequency is 2.6GHz.
    It isn't a problem to find that diode, but a problem is to find a model. All I found is S-parametres, but it isn't helps me. Diodes I wish to use haven't spice models, and not-suitable diodes ahve models
    I found some diodes that have good characteristics, but they have ADS models. It can't be used in MWO, isn't?
    Please, help me to find diode model. Or explain how to convert ADS model to SPICE if it possible. I'm confused
    And sorry for my English :)
    "Good diodes":
    http://www.nxp.com/products/diodes/p...#documentation
    http://www.nxp.com/products/diodes/p...#documentation
    http://www.nxp.com/products/diodes/p...#documentation
    http://www.nxp.com/products/diodes/p...#documentation

    Have ADS models:
    http://www.skyworksinc.com/Product.aspx?ProductID=483
    http://www.skyworksinc.com/Product.aspx?ProductID=478
    http://www.skyworksinc.com/Product.aspx?ProductID=476

    •   AltAdvertisment

        
       

  2. #2
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 10,635, Level: 24
    Achievements:
    7 years registered
    tony_lth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Beijing
    Posts
    1,931
    Helped
    374 / 374
    Points
    10,635
    Level
    24

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Hi, you can find circuit models of the PIN, so you just need to input the it into AWR, then you can simulate.



  3. #3
    Newbie level 4
    Points: 33, Level: 1

    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    6
    Helped
    0 / 0
    Points
    33
    Level
    1

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    I know how to import the model into AWR, but I can't find suitable model. And that's a problem...



  4. #4
    Full Member level 5
    Points: 4,364, Level: 15

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    282
    Helped
    102 / 102
    Points
    4,364
    Level
    15

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    SPICE is not able to fully model PIN diodes, it can not cope with carrier life time.
    The best you can do is to model it in the on or off state, in which case the S-parameter models will be adequate.



    •   AltAdvertisment

        
       

  5. #5
    Newbie level 4
    Points: 33, Level: 1

    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    6
    Helped
    0 / 0
    Points
    33
    Level
    1

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Oh, really? My professor said S-parametres aren't suitable for modelling. He told I must use SPICE, but I think he will not against the S-pars. Please, give me a link how to make a model from S-pars, if possible.



    •   AltAdvertisment

        
       

  6. #6
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 12,460, Level: 26

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,930
    Helped
    790 / 790
    Points
    12,460
    Level
    26

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Building a nonlinear model is expert work, nothing you can easily do as a beginner in a few weeks.

    You can buy a library with nonlinear diode models, including some PIN diodes, from Modelithics.
    http://www.modelithics.com/products.asp?a=view&id=2
    This library can be used with Microwave Office or ADS.

    Personally, I support the idea of using S-parameters. This is what most designers would do. Your professor might be a bit optimistic regarding the nonlinear models.



  7. #7
    Newbie level 4
    Points: 33, Level: 1

    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    6
    Helped
    0 / 0
    Points
    33
    Level
    1

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Quote Originally Posted by volker@muehlhaus View Post
    Building a nonlinear model is expert work, nothing you can easily do as a beginner in a few weeks.

    You can buy a library with nonlinear diode models, including some PIN diodes, from Modelithics.
    http://www.modelithics.com/products.asp?a=view&id=2
    This library can be used with Microwave Office or ADS.

    Personally, I support the idea of using S-parameters. This is what most designers would do. Your professor might be a bit optimistic regarding the nonlinear models.
    Thanks.
    I'm not a professional in modeling. It is just training task. So I prefer free models :)

    Could you explain me, how to use S-pars? How I can make a model from this? For example, I download S-pars, import them into MWO (appositely, as Netlist or as Data Files?), and what then? Will MWO understand parametres as a subcircuit, or I must do anything else?

    Sorry, I have too many queastions, but I want to understand this.



  8. #8
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 12,460, Level: 26

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,930
    Helped
    790 / 790
    Points
    12,460
    Level
    26

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Quote Originally Posted by Pblcya View Post
    Could you explain me, how to use S-pars? How I can make a model from this?
    To create a model, you will need to run DC measurements and S-parameter measurements. The most widely software for creating models is this: http://www.keysight.com/en/pc-129714...n?cc=US&lc=eng
    You can have a look at the documentation to understand the basic workflow.

    I think you should forget about the non-linear model, and use linear simulation with S-parameters, as it was suggested above by G4BCH.


    2 members found this post helpful.

    •   AltAdvertisment

        
       

  9. #9
    Newbie level 4
    Points: 33, Level: 1

    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    6
    Helped
    0 / 0
    Points
    33
    Level
    1

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Thank you, I'll try to do this :)



  10. #10
    Advanced Member level 5
    Points: 33,513, Level: 44

    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    4,795
    Helped
    1416 / 1416
    Points
    33,513
    Level
    44

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    All the ROHM PIN diodes have attached also Spice models. You can use any of them in MWO.

    http://www.rohm.com/web/global/searc...20PIN%20Diodes

    To import the Spice model in MWO (and update the XML library) is not an easy job, but you can do a quick trick to modify one of the existing MWO Spice diode model (any of them).

    Open any of the RHOM .lib Spice models from the link above using notepad, copy the text file, open any .mdl diode model in MWO library also using notepad (for example Infineon/BA512), overwrite the existing BA512 text file with the text from .lib file.
    Reboot MWO, and now when you choose Infineon/BA512 S-diode, actually inside is the PIN diode from RHOM.
    Remember that you lost the original BA512 model, and if you want you can save it in other place before this modification.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  11. #11
    Newbie level 4
    Points: 33, Level: 1

    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    6
    Helped
    0 / 0
    Points
    33
    Level
    1

    Re: Need pin-diode SPICE model

    Thank you too! A very good solution, I didn't think in this direction. I'll try tomorrow, and then write about results :)



--[[ ]]--