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Personally i think china are often the scapegoat for poor operating procedures, product specification and standards. Lots of excellent product is produced in China.
Just out of curiosity, I got a pcb fabrication build quoted by a china fabricator. I was actually surprised to find that the pricing wasn't really as competitive as I was expecting. Another thing that wasn't too appealing was that they wanted immediate payment before doing anything. There was no option for Net 30 or Net 15. Moreover, they wanted a $300 USD shipping charge tacked on and there was a minimum of 3 days for shipment. What will happen if after all this, my boards don't come out satisfactorily? That's not a comfortable risk to save a couple hundred dollars in the event the boards do come out great.
What recourse will I have if one of my designs winds up in the wrong hands and gets mass produced and re-sold? There is none. This is why whenever there is a meeting between the heads of state between the US and China, counterfeiting and piracy is a top topic brought up by the US side.
For prototype pcb builds needed in a quick turn, China isn't a viable option and the risk is still too high for my tastes. Once the two governments of the US and China can come up with enforceable IP protection, then I'd be more comfy.
For those who are getting a great deal from China, then that's great to hear. For myself, I just can't expose myself to the risk of rampant piracy.
I really hope that China fixes the IP protection problems it has. Everyone in the world will benefit.
As i am just a PCB factory in China. I am a chinese. Actually, at present, most PCB purchaser is from USA and EU, but made in China.
For payment, that is no way. As in the beginning, of course we need payment in advance. As we stand the risk. For delivery chage, i do believe our chinese express company will be more cheap than overseas. i have this experience.
I think, at present, the best way for overseas customer is still to choose their local trading company(actually, most of our customer is the trading company in USA or EU). Then the trade company have good relations with the end-usder, and also they do the ship work, after sale service,and share some financial risk. They are a bridge between chinese factory and overseas customer.
But still, i also do believe, it is a trend to shorten this gap. The end-user will most likely to choose the real manufactuer. As they could most better to control the quality and safe. Of course, i said a volume-big customer, not quite small pcb purchaser. And also it need times.
Anyway, i hope to discusss with you and also hope we could produce the right PCB for you. As we are a pcb factory here, and also want to start business with you.
Well,honestly,
at this moment if one still think that the low price is the only reason to do the outsourcing to china, then it is an out-of-dated view already
I am one of those who work with China a lot, and have been there many times.
Like Oddbudsman says, it's most often due to poor operating procedures. The big guys like Dell, IBM, Samsung, Sony etc. are all there, and they have the quality more or less under control.
If locally produced Chinese products have quality problems, the guys like Sony, Samsung, IBM, etc. have incoming quality assurance to weed out the junk.
In any case, it doesn't really matter. The Chinese home market is huge, with a less sophisticated customer base. The Chinese can sell to themselves for donkey years, while they absorb and learn about quality standards, product design, etc. When they have the quality under control, and a pleasing product, the Wallmart's and Tesco's of the world will come knocking on their door. Whese guys have no problem selling you the stuff that you so pig-headed declared as "Not a chance"
I believe there are a number of assembly and pcb fab houses in North America who perform work here in North America, but farm out large production jobs to China to realize scale of ecomony. I'm looking for just such a company right now. When I find it, I'll post the details.
Incidentally, the company that I now seek - the one I read about a few weeks ago, claims to have security to prevent your intellectual designs from exiting the manufacturing facility. Naturally, nothing is 100% safe when humans are involved, but it seems quite reasonable to expect that some companies here (not just the giants) have figured out the Chinese manufacturing market to their distinct advantage.
Just out of curiosity, I got a pcb fabrication build quoted by a china fabricator. I was actually surprised to find that the pricing wasn't really as competitive as I was expecting. Another thing that wasn't too appealing was that they wanted immediate payment before doing anything. There was no option for Net 30 or Net 15. Moreover, they wanted a $300 USD shipping charge tacked on and there was a minimum of 3 days for shipment. What will happen if after all this, my boards don't come out satisfactorily? That's not a comfortable risk to save a couple hundred dollars in the event the boards do come out great.
What recourse will I have if one of my designs winds up in the wrong hands and gets mass produced and re-sold? There is none. This is why whenever there is a meeting between the heads of state between the US and China, counterfeiting and piracy is a top topic brought up by the US side.
For prototype pcb builds needed in a quick turn, China isn't a viable option and the risk is still too high for my tastes. Once the two governments of the US and China can come up with enforceable IP protection, then I'd be more comfy.
For those who are getting a great deal from China, then that's great to hear. For myself, I just can't expose myself to the risk of rampant piracy.
I really hope that China fixes the IP protection problems it has. Everyone in the world will benefit.
i understand your problem.you are right,there is so many points need to improve in china.in fact,we are tring our best to handle these,we need time.
about business rules you refer,i am sorry that you should accept.you know there are so many pcb fabrications in china,you should have a think why these maker can operate normally.
In every country there are good peoples and bad peoples.
Do you think for exemple if the penicelyn have not been dicovered we would live without it forever. Do you thing we couldn't have discover it one or two century laters.
Is it because you discover things before others that you dont let poor country make it and progress.
Personally i think china are often the scapegoat for poor operating procedures, product specification and standards. Lots of excellent product is produced in China.
HuH??? Come now! Where have you been all these years? Are you blind???
"...Lots of excellent products produced..." from China? You're dreaming!
I have been in the electronics industry for over 40 years. I have *yet* to see major inprovements in quality control or even acceptable quality products. It is simply not there. Now we are in 2009 and just recently one of my grandchildren was wairing a neckless laced with excessive amounts of lead! China seems to simply not to care or to listen.
Having said the above, I have nothing but respect for the Chinese people themselves. They do the job as instructed and can't help the actions of their employers. They need to live and pay their bills too.
Just don't tell me "China is a great nation". I fail to see it. They (China) are ignorant and arrogant. Again, the people of China are good and I have several Chinese friends. I love them. It is the arrogance of the Chinese government for failing to comply with international regulations and health issues. Hmm, 'health issues', another good subject. And then there are the human issues... do I need to go on?
Anyways, I recommend to watch the news more closely for a more relevant opinion. I figure you are chinese so no personal offense to you is intended.
Just don't tell me "China is a great nation". I fail to see it. They (China) are ignorant and arrogant. Again, the people of China are good and I have several Chinese friends. I love them. It is the arrogance of the Chinese government for failing to comply with international regulations and health issues. Hmm, 'health issues', another good subject. And then there are the human issues... do I need to go on?
Anyways, I recommend to watch the news more closely for a more relevant opinion. I figure you are chinese so no personal offense to you is intended.
The nation is the peoples, their culture and their history not the governments. All the goverments are arogant coz politic is based on laying and and make profit from the confidence of people. Maybe the chinese governement is arogant but at least it is not two faced like all the other governemts like US with its dirty history (vietnam, hiroshima,somalia) their crimes agains nations, human being in the name of democracy and freedom this if you dont consider the ecological issues.
Canada has all what a nation need like water food and lot of natural resouces that is strong enough for all. Also Canada is isolated in the word I mean their only one neibourg is US that's why your goverment is ok.
It's only in bad circumstances that we discover the hidden ugly face of a governement.
China is a great nation.
You can't deny the history man !
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