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    how to make an electric arc

    hello

    can anyone help me to make a powerful electric arc about 1cm long
    It should be really powerful and need not be long
    Is it better to use DC or AC
    Last edited by 23ronnie11; 20th March 2011 at 16:34.

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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    Build a Tesla coil, Jacobs ladder, a car ignition coil, the flash circuit of a disposable camera or electronics of a fly zap racket



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    DC gives you a more steady arc, although there is erosion of one of your electrodes. FWIW, the arc impedance is about .5 Ohms though a much higher voltage is required to strike the arc. I would Google "Tesla coils". It all depends on what you want to use the arc for.
    Frank



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i need a continuous arc to heat up air .i just need a simple and effective way to make a small but powerful arc.
    is high voltage required to make a powerful arc ..so what should i use a flyback transformer or a mot



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    Use a LM555 oscillator driving a power transistor with a car ignition coil as a collector load



    •   Alt20th March 2011, 16:50

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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    To comment some previous posts, I think electrical arc isn't the same as a high voltage spark, as achievable with an ignition coil.

    An electric arc is a plasma discharge maintained by the supplied power. The classical carbon arc lamp has been operated at about 30 to 60 V AC with currents of 10 to 100 A. You'll need a high current transformer with high leak inductance, e.g. a welding transformer. Some safety risks related to arc discharge should be considered:
    - strong UV radiation, dangerous to eyes and unprotected skin
    - generation of nitrouses gases and ozone


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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    I need a continuous arc not a spark .i need this arc to make an arc rocket so any suggestions .the problem with a tesla coil is that it is to big . i think a car ignition coil can only give a spark .Do you guys think i should use a flyback transformer or a mot .if you think the flyback is better can you suggest a good driver circuit



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    Tesla coils are only big because they need to be else the voltage they produce will flash between the turns of the coils. Using lower power and lower voltages would mitigate against the size. An oil filled ignition coil is a very good start because of the oil dielectric they can pack more voltage into a smaller space. You can also get them from car scrappers for loose change. In a car they only produce a spark because that what the driving circuit does.
    FWIW Years ago I built an electronic ignition circuit to my own design and got the design wrong. The result was a continuos discharge that flashed across from the HT contact to the case of a ignition coil, a distance of about 50 mm.
    Frank



    •   Alt21st March 2011, 17:24

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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i need this arc to make an arc rocket
    You know, that you are talking about kW electrical power levels?



    •   Alt21st March 2011, 20:07

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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i may need kw power level .
    please can you show that circuit (ignition coil) .can i adapt that for a flyback transformer though i don't need a 5cm long arc



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    Before discussing about circuits, some points should be clarified:
    - What's the intended primary power source for the electric arc?
    - How do you intend to ignnite it? As already mentioned, altough the operation voltage of the arc will be low (several 10 V), a high voltage source is required for ignition. Alternatively, it can be ignited by making the electrodes touch, as usual with arc welding or a classical carbon arc lamp.



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    I recall the film projectors used when I was a kid (is the system the same today?).

    There were two carbon rods with the ends kept at a constant distance from each other. Never had the chance to see how it actually worked.

    They generated LOT of heat.

    Look also for the technology used for the big reflectors (WWII) to illuminate targets for gunnery. IIRC they used a similar principle. Searchlight or spotlights.
    Last edited by atferrari; 22nd March 2011 at 12:30. Reason: Wrogn spelling



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    You are referring to carbon arc lamps. I already mentioned it. See this wikipedia article for the different techniques Arc lamp - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Today's cinema projectors are exclusively using high pressure xenon arc lamps.

    Carbon arc lamps usually have an electromagnetical mechanism that controls the electrode distance, keeping the current at a defined setpoint.



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i haven't thought about the power source .what do you suggest
    an eliminator
    or a battery
    i don't think i will be able to make a contact after the rocket is made



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    what do you suggest an eliminator or a battery
    I won't expect kW power from these sources.



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i am not sure if i will need kw power .but if it is required what power source should i use and what should i use to get the arc



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    You didn't clarify your intentions exactly. Some comments make me think, that you want to actually fly an arc rocket. I assume that it can't work because no available electrical power source has the energy density (in terms of E/m) to generate a sufficient thrust. But it's just a guess.

    Moving a vehicle by an arc rocket propulsion for demonstration purposes may be possible. For a mobile device, super capacitors offer the highest specific power in a 0.1 to 10 sec time scale, for longer experiment duration, NiMH or Li-Ion battery would be preferable.



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i don't want to fly the rocket i just want make a working model that produces a small thrust



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    i don't want to fly the rocket
    That's good. I already suggested a standard arc welding transformer as power source. It would require an additional high voltage ignition circuit, if you can't ignite the arc by shorting the electrodes. With a battery or supercap, an inverter is needed.

    But I guess, you should start with the thermodynamical design. It should clarify the arc power demand.



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    Re: how to make an electric arc

    the problem is that i don't have an arc welding transformer i don't think i will be able to get one .but i can get a mot of a flyback transformer .Do you think heating the gas before going to the electrodes make it easier to make the arc



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