Which PCB tool to choose?

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EDAboard.com Forum Index -> PCB Routing & Schematic Layout software & Simulation -> Which PCB tool to choose?

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miho

Joined: 01 Dec 2003
Posts: 32

17 May 2004 13:41 dxdesigner sucks

I know, this topic has been beaten to death, but anyway... Maybe I can get some serious hints when specifying some constraints...

I am looking for a PCB tool which suits the following:

boards up to 14 layers with high speeds
fine pitch BGA components (e.g. FPGAs)
readily available libraries
signal integrity simulation might become an issue soon

We are a small start-up, but not a board design company, just developing our own hard- and software. Cost is an issue. $5-7k would be ok.

We had boards made by suppliers who used Protel and hand-routing, would Specctra save us time with good auto-routing results?

Considering Protel's price tag and the fact that OrCad is about the same, we are wondering id Orcad would be the better choice. What about Mentor's Pads?

Any thoughts are appreciated
miho

Cluricaun

Joined: 28 Sep 2001
Posts: 704
Helped: 13

17 May 2004 14:21 cadpack pcb

Hi

There are some discussions about different PCB software at this forum, search there and you might get some hints.
Besides the normal routing softwares I think you could try Electra, and Proteus is also quite good, I do not know for 14 Layers though.

The electra is similar to Specctra, except the price.

123.labcenter.co.uk
123.connecteda.com/
123.pulsonix.com/

123=www

Cluricaun

Last edited by Cluricaun on 21 May 2004 8:20; edited 1 time in total

mrcube_ns

Joined: 10 Apr 2002
Posts: 429
Helped: 11
Location: Dark side of the Moon

17 May 2004 21:30 multiple vias cadstar

In firm where I was working last year I used Pcad2001 with Specctra autorouter.

This combination works very nice.

Mr.Cube

binu G

Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 739
Helped: 9
Location: Bangalore

18 May 2004 4:27 interface cadstar specttra

mrcube_ns wrote:

In firm where I was working last year I used Pcad2001 with Specctra autorouter.

This combination works very nice.

Mr.Cube

ya thats the best option to get the job complet faster and effective.
but one should know how to define the rules in specctra.

binu g

C8H10N4O2

Joined: 13 May 2004
Posts: 13

18 May 2004 5:28 signal integrity freeware spectraquest

Protel and OrCad are both integrated solutions. You can easily go between PCB and schematic. PADS and PCAD are more geared toward board design. Thus, for pure board design, PADS and PCAD are likely to be slightly better and for system level design, Protel and OrCad might offer better integration.

AN

Joined: 28 Apr 2001
Posts: 49

18 May 2004 5:53 specctra for pulsonix

please don't say that Orcad is good for beginner!!!!
Layout is a worst tool which I use!!!
AN

rauol

Joined: 02 Oct 2002
Posts: 363
Helped: 11

18 May 2004 18:56 cadstar multiple vias

try Pulsonix, easy interface,quick learning curve. i have used its evaluation version.
www.pulsonix.com

AltEdward

Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 1

20 May 2004 8:49 dxdesigner .ini files

strongly recommend use Cadence/Allergo..

tlp71@hotmail.com

Joined: 14 May 2002
Posts: 476
Helped: 4

20 May 2004 10:04 invoking boardstation re is very slow

allegro is a good tool.
You can use many feature to accelerate your work.

ynhe

Joined: 28 May 2001
Posts: 326
Helped: 4
Location: China

20 May 2004 10:14 visula layout

PADS2004 is good.
It include schematic capture,analog and mixture signal spice simulation(intusoft icap8.1.x),Hyperlynx simulation and so on.

ynhe

skywalker

Joined: 27 Nov 2001
Posts: 158
Helped: 3
Location: Earth

20 May 2004 14:25 purchasing eda software

Hi miho,

for cost at $5-7k i think PADS are best choice, no problem for 14 layers,
no problem for working with h--speed rules and simulation !

Pcb, schematic, Hyp*er*Linx, are very affirmed tools ! Like no others remeber, at same (low<->medium) cost off-course ! But they work really well !

Best of PADS, but not same costs, 1st Exp*edi*tion 2nd All*egro tools.

let me know, Skywalker.

prokopec

Joined: 13 Feb 2003
Posts: 28
Helped: 1

21 May 2004 4:55 reannotation diptrace

I use PADS too, PADS is very good.

Daniel

SphinX

Joined: 25 Jan 2002
Posts: 1069
Helped: 28
Location: EGYPT

21 May 2004 15:40 cadence orcad terrible

Hi,

I use OrCAD.
OrCAD Capture is very good but OrCAD LAYOUT doesn't Sad

I will use PCAD 2002 in conjuction with Capture.

SphinX

bigrice911

Joined: 27 Apr 2004
Posts: 84

23 May 2004 15:23 protel disadvantage

maybe Cadence Allegro is your best choice, but Mentor WG will be a good option too.

miho

Joined: 01 Dec 2003
Posts: 32

24 May 2004 14:44 electra autorouter integration with orcad

seems like there are still plenty of choices and no real winner since everybody has his/her personal preference... Smile

cadence allegro seems a bit too big for us, we will not make use of the ic-pcb codesign feature, i think. i am wondering a bit why cadence has two tools in the market, are they gonna merge them at some time since they bought orcad a while ago?

sudeepb

Joined: 17 Jul 2002
Posts: 16

24 May 2004 15:50 kicad converter powerpcb

I am using Orcad Capture for Circuit design and Cadstar for PCB layout which really comes good.
Orcad with Spectra is also good one.

Jaannee

Joined: 01 Jan 1970
Posts: 26

24 May 2004 20:19 dxdesigner stinks

Hi!
I have worked with both Pads and Cadstar and must say that Pads stinks in comparison. (And Cadstar has the most beautiful support for hand-routing)

I have also worked some with Orcad and I agree with earlier post that it may not be the best choice for the not so experienced.

It´s like allways, taste differs...

/Janne

sinatra

Joined: 29 Mar 2002
Posts: 243
Helped: 12
Location: Neverland

24 May 2004 22:10 kicad build in lib power

Hello all.
How about the free tools? There are not very many arround but there are some.
Has anyone tryed PCB (an old tool from unix that is now available also in windows under cygwin emulation)? PCB seems to be a quite good pcb tool.
For the schematics there are gnuEDA and Xcircuit.
There's also a free circuit simulator that is part of gnuEDA.
All those tools are completely free, no license etc...
Can they already compete with the commercial ones?????
S.

eternal_nan

Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 158
Helped: 15
Location: eternity

24 May 2004 22:16 visula

I find OrCAD to be a satisfactory tool for the most part. The schematic capture is nicer than Protel's, the layout is more or less the same quality (unless you get allegro, in which case it is better). Protel has built in signal integrity simulation, but it is not "industrial grade". Protel's autorouter generally does a better job than orcad's and is overall quite good for boards >6 layers, after that it is not that good and Specctra becomes worth it.

Maybe Protel+Specctra is the best way to go, given your potential signal integrity simulation needs.

miho

Joined: 01 Dec 2003
Posts: 32

26 May 2004 10:02 pcb 123 libraries for linx

@ eternal_nan: You are saying that the simulation is not industrial grade. well, so far we got our boards running without simulation but will this simulation help at all in the future? ok, if the simulation indicates a problem, there probably really is a big one, but if it indicates no problem, there still might be one, right?

I am wondering if that non-industrial-grade simulation is worth anything at all... Any experiences with that, anyone?

AN

Joined: 28 Apr 2001
Posts: 49

08 Jun 2004 6:55 prices pulsonix

if you want to work with connection to component database you should consider PADS
it can work with many databases together (ORCAD CIS can work with only one database!)
also PADS has VERY GOOD interactiv routing FIRE
you can look for details here: http://www.mentor.com/pads/demos/
an

wh

Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 17
Helped: 1

08 Jun 2004 7:32 orcad rubbish

I'm using Protel, but are not sastify with its menu system & GUI.

kiks

Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 28

13 Jun 2004 23:06 orcad for beginner

You want a good package for everyday use? I bought a package called Cadpack from matrixmultimedia. Its cheap and fine for what I use it for. Has schematic capture and autorouting. It exports to dxf and a few other file formats. I have produced many good layouts with it. They have what they call a student version. This is actually the Lite version of the Proteus software. The student/home version is selling for £39.00. Check out the following link:

http://www.matrixmultimedia.com/product.php?Prod=CADPACK

lyric

Joined: 29 Jun 2003
Posts: 26

14 Jun 2004 3:36 eagle+reannotation

PADS2004 is your choice

binu G

Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 739
Helped: 9
Location: Bangalore

14 Jun 2004 4:55 which pcb layout to choose

pads2004 is for medium level design not for the higher end which have complex definition in the nets.

MentorSI

Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 5

14 Jun 2004 12:56 cadstar pros and cons

Mentor WG200X is so good to accomplish your work!

bjxxh

Joined: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 8

20 Jun 2004 2:46 cadpak spice

Mentor PowerPcb is also a good choice.

taring77

Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 146
Helped: 2

21 Jun 2004 4:43 databook dxdesigner

i totally agree with Bjxxh, mentor Power PCB is quiet good. i n my designer did a few projects with this software n its flexible.
Take time to learn the details.

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21 Jun 2004 4:43 Ads

yangvic

Joined: 24 Jun 2004
Posts: 51

24 Jun 2004 4:06 kicad atium

I think protel still is a good choice for simple design.If disign is more complex, cadence's allegro is better.But cadence's schematic tool - concept is bad.I think OrCAD schematic tool is best for sch.And OrCAD schematic can use allegro route,too.