mentor graphics pcb tools

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elec-eng

Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Posts: 277
Helped: 15

02 Jun 2007 15:18 veribest pcb tool

What is the difference between different mentor pcb tools

pads
expedition

also our company has a choise to buy pads or expedition or Altium designer

So which to buy

thanks

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02 Jun 2007 15:18 Ads

melc

Joined: 08 Apr 2005
Posts: 394
Helped: 45

02 Jun 2007 17:11 mentor neutral cadence allegro

Pads is not bad but quite difficult to work with, Altium looks the same. However for FPGA design Altium have powerful libraries and firmware editor.
Pads have some nice readable documetation (splitted in three: capture, router and layout), Altium has some very splitted documentation more difficult to read.
Who is the best ? I can't say one or the other, but evaluating Altium looks the same difficult like Pads.

concat

Joined: 05 Dec 2001
Posts: 207
Helped: 3

07 Jun 2007 15:46 allegro pads comparison

expedition is the high end tool for high speed design, difficult to learn but powerfull. auto active technology is very good for dynamic hand routing

TraceRouter

Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 132
Helped: 17
Location: Wichita, KS

07 Jun 2007 19:43 complex pcb maintenance

Expedition isn't that hard to learn, but then again I used BoardStation before I moved to Expedition Smile

Rame

Joined: 23 Dec 2005
Posts: 369
Helped: 40
Location: BANGALORE

08 Jun 2007 9:39 mentor pads layout modeless commands

Hi,

Among the Pcb design tools available from Mentor Graphics,i feel Pads layout is easier though i haven't used other software in first place,its an views & comments from my folks who have worked on them.

Expedition and Board station are used for high end designs(high speed),both are competitive to allegro(Cadence),for eg,constraint setting etc....

It may vary from individual,and again depends upon the usage of the tool extensively.

Regards

Ramesh

elec-eng

Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Posts: 277
Helped: 15

09 Jun 2007 14:12 pcb tools,pads

so please can any one give a comparison between Mentor Expedition and Cadence Allegro

i know that they are both very powerfull
but i am confused which to use
which is more easy to learn and which is more efficient

Rame

Joined: 23 Dec 2005
Posts: 369
Helped: 40
Location: BANGALORE

11 Jun 2007 5:57 mentor graphics

Hi,

Both expedition and allegro creates a quality board and the designer makes it happen.

Well,its you to decide on the tool,when your using any tool extensively you shall be comfortable working on that tool.

Regards

Ramesh

dindeds

Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 130
Helped: 9

11 Jun 2007 10:35 power pcb modeless commands

It depends on what you want to design,
- normal analog or digital design using std parts (leaded or smd) involving a few layers (<6).
- complex design using fine-pitch ic's involving several hundreds Mhz (or more) and several critical layers (signals and power planes).

For the former, I use Protel (99SE & DXP) all the way -very easy and fast turn-out.
For the latter, Expedition beats Protel in ease of routing and get you out of trouble most of the time.
Of course, it is hard to learn MG Expediton initially but it pays off in due time.
I think this is the same case in Allegro too.

verg

Joined: 19 Feb 2004
Posts: 10
Location: Philippines

14 Jun 2007 0:16 mentor graphics veribest 99

Pads is one Cad tool that one can easily learn....A self contained system with all kinds of cool functions and process simulations. Pads_Logic as one, (schematic capture) wherein one can create all the necessary logic symbols which you can then input the required geometry and part no. for such devices. Pads_Pcb, where you then create the geometry footprints for the symbols you have on your schematic diagram and all its attributes (part). Having all these made, you can sync both of these files either from the Logic diagram or from the Pcb Layout. This alone is the best part of these platform. Both modules have modeless commands under your finger tips just by using single button keys and number keys. One can set templates for sarting his or her design regarding layer counts, that can be opened when the decision comes stored somewhere in a Data Base directory.Pads is not that hard to learn, in fact I found it a very easy tool to learn...I know there are other neat things about Pads like, hyperlynx and DFT Audit for board testibility but, this will make it too long. I think it is one reason why Mentor Graphics acquired this package.

In the meantime, Mentor Board Station adoted another tool from it and that is where Expedition came about. A little bit smaller package than that of the board station platform but as powerful as the former. If one have knowledge of the first platform, the next one is not that hard to learn. Both have different command menu syntax, but does the same functions. Expedition can be sold by itself or as part of the Board Station platform. This platform is for high end designs and for large companies with tons of work and can afford to spend maintenance cost....
This of course are vague description of these platforms from one that uses them all the time. But again, you can take it or leave it.... Neutral

ucsenavag

Joined: 16 Jul 2002
Posts: 17

15 Jun 2007 19:27 mentor graphic product bad quality

Hi,
I am doing the second MG Expedition 2005 training course now, it is very powerful ...
The trainer says that Expedition is a native MG product while Pads was just bought by MG and MG is now rewriting Pads, so I guess Expedition is more professional - although I never used Pads Very Happy

concat

Joined: 05 Dec 2001
Posts: 207
Helped: 3

18 Jun 2007 3:24 mentor and cadence pcb comparison

Hi,

four years ago, I have trained for Mentor Expedition WG 2000.5, at that time it was also very power full tool for high end designs, however. to manage design capture is still a chalenge with me.

It's very impression with Autoactive technology. and now with WG 2005.5 SP1. it's become more native with the designer.

I also trained for Allegro, but i still like WG

have a nice day

lofeng

Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 6

13 Jun 2008 10:11 pcb tools danish

I had used PADS and Expedition.Expedition is much more powerful than PADS.

senilicus

Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 87
Helped: 12
Location: The Netherlands

16 Jun 2008 6:44 mentor graphics pcb

ucsenavag wrote:

I hate to disapoint you but Expedition PCB is not a native MG product (wich one is anyway?).
Expedition used to be known as Veribest Destination PCB. in 1999 Mentor took over Veribest in orderto re-establish its position in the pcb market.

whiplash

Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 18
Helped: 2

18 Jun 2008 15:17 learn mentor graphics

Having used all three PCB tools here is my opinion:

Expedition = Allegro

Expedition, Allegro > PADS

If you are doing high-speed, lots of diff pair routing or HDI you need to go with Allegro or Expedition. PADS is not stable enough when boards get really challenging. That being said, if you are doing simple designs, PADS is the best bang for your buck.

Expedition and Allegro are quite similar in their capabilities and it really depends on which flow you prefer or already have experience in.

Other points to take into consideration:
- Mentor technical support is better than Cadence technical support.
- In our experience Mentor Sales will do much more for you than Cadence (we've found Cadence to be a very arrogant company in the past 5 years).

pcb007

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Posts: 2

19 Jun 2008 4:09 mentor graphics cost pcb

“we've found Cadence to be a very arrogant company in the past 5 years.”
It's true.

rinj

Joined: 02 Dec 2008
Posts: 8
Helped: 1

05 Dec 2008 11:17 mentor graphics to allegro

“we've found Cadence to be a very arrogant company in the past 5 years.”
It's true. "

I too feel the same.
I am a cadence costumer for the past 3 years, and a member of cadence users & forum. None of the tech support contacted me all these days and not received any updated mails, not invited for the user conferences which is held in my city. Crying or Very sad

But recently I happened to visit MG website, soon I got a call from a local tech support, and later I could attend the U2U conference, which helped me to know their products. Now, I feel an attachment with MG tools, eventhough I am not familiar with it. Very Happy

regards,
rinj

skywalker

Joined: 27 Nov 2001
Posts: 158
Helped: 3
Location: Earth

14 Dec 2008 1:04 mentor graphics pcb pads price

Hi,

At this time the support of Mentor are very best, for all aspect. Expedition, are high-end tool, but Not so ease to use.

For my experience, PADS > Altium for pcb and routing. The DX designer are now updated, not easy but good, need some updates for increase the ease of use.

If Mentor expand PADS for large and critical boards (only one step < expedition), for Reliability, support for Linux platform, and (Important) include a SI Simulator in PADS basic bundles. PADS go to the best ease and powerful system for all need, at low cost, Without competitors !

Remember in the past PADS was competitor of high-end tools.
Skywalker.